“…What parts of American life do you think would most outrage Jesus?
Our selfishness. Our resort to war when it's not necessary. I think that Jesus would be disappointed in our ignoring the plight of those around us who are suffering and our focus on our own selfish short-term needs. I think he would be appalled, actually.

You've had a lot of experience with suffering. Part of your career has been representing people who we see as suffering. You've also had what you called "world stopping pain" and suffering in your own life. What has that suffering taught you?

It's been part of my own personal faith journey. Because I've done what I think a lot of Americans have done, which [is]: I was raised in a very Christian home and a Southern Baptist church, and baptized in the Southern Baptist church. My dad has been a deacon in the Southern Baptist church for many years. In fact, we went back to my church a few weeks ago and he was getting the Lay Person of the Year Award, which we were all very proud of him for…. Polls show that a lot of Americans think the Democratic Party is hostile to religion. Do you think that the Democratic Party is hostile to religion? If not, why do you think it's perceived that way? Do you think it's changing?

I think that there are lots of very good, strong national Democratic leaders who are people of deep faith. President Carter would be a clear example of that. I think there are lots of us who are people of deep faith.

I think that one of the things that's happened on some of the hot cultural societal issues is that those issues have been used to create a wedge, in some cases, between people of deep faith and the Democratic Party.

And I think one of our responsibilities, one of my responsibilities as one of the leaders of the Democratic Party, is to bridge that gap that has been created. I could go into any evangelical church in America, for instance, and talk about poverty, and our responsibility to those who are living in poverty, and get a terrific response. I am certain of that…. You've been critical, obviously, of President Bush. But, where do you give him the most credit? What do you think he's done a really good job?

You know, I have to be honest about this. I no longer give him much credit. Because I feel like a lot of what the president has done has been either ideologically driven or, in some cases, ego driven. And I don't think he's been open and honest with America in the way that I believe he should have.

I do applaud how he responded in the immediate aftermath of September 11th... I think America was in a difficult place and he was strong for a short period of time after that. But beyond that, it's very hard for me to find [much credit to give]--the cutting away of nutrition programs and so forth from the most needy people in America and taking away funds for kids to be able to go to college. I couldn't personally live with that. I don't know. And it troubles me. It troubles me.

And I think he's very personally invested in his definition of success in Iraq, which I think undermines good judgment about what we ought to be doing under these circumstances.

Last question. In this season of Lent, what's your focus? Are you giving something up? Are you trying to focus on something? Are you trying to fast from something or pick up a new habit?

I haven't done any of those things. You want an honest answer, so I'm going to tell you I haven't done any of those things. What I intend to continue to do, though, if I can bring us full circle back to the beginning of this discussion, is no matter whether anyone asks, no matter whether any other candidate ever raises the issue, as long as I'm alive and breathing and as long as I am a presidential candidate, I will be speaking up for the little guy. And I think that a lot of that has been lost in American politics for strategic political reasons. And their voice needs to be heard--desperately needs to be heard. And if I do nothing else, their voice will be heard through me.”